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 Post subject: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitting.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:51 pm 
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The boosted mains water pipe in our building has got a slow leak, at a T-junction. The water pressure varies from 4 to 6 bar.

The incoming pipe is 90mm high pressure pvc with the T-offs being 75mm and 50mm. It’s the 75mm joint that is leaking. Unfortunately, I don’t know whether the leak is at the reducer in the T; or between the pipe and the reducer.

Image

A plumber has attempted a temporary repair using tape which - surprise, surprise - hasn’t held. So the question is: what’s the best way to effect a permanent repair?

The current proposal is to replace the T. Simples? Hmmm … Thinking about it, I have my doubts. Why? Well …

1. Installing the new T will require cutting out the old one (nat’ …). Doing this - unless I’m mistaken and please say so if I am! - will reduce the length of each of the 3 pipes by the amount of pipe that is currently fitted into the T’s sockets.

So, to rectify the deficit, make-up pieces of pipe will need to be installed, using couplers to connect them to the existing pipe work. Fine in theory; but it also means that we will change from having the current 3 joints to 9. That cannot be good.

2. Also, I don’t see how you can install solvent-welded sleeve couplers when the existing pipe work is rigidly mounted - you won’t have the necessary wriggle room, surely? So that means using Fernco-type repair couplers. Hmmm ... not too keen. And I’m still left with 6 more potentially leaky joints than before.

So another thought is to not disturb the T, but instead attempt a repair in place. Here are 2 possible approaches.

Approach 1
1. First, plug the leak source with a 2-part epoxy mastic.
2. As an extra precaution: slit a short length of 75 mm pipe down its length. Then fit this over the existing pipe, with the slit uppermost, and butt it up tight against the leak source. Solvent weld in place.
3. Complete by wrapping the whole thing in a quality repair tape.

Approach 2
1. Cut the 75mm pipe a short way upstream of the T.
2. Now remove the stub or pipe left in the T using heat - heat gun, or flaming solvent. But read on …
3. Solvent weld a new length of pipe into the T and connect the other end to the existing pipe using a Fernco.

The problem I have here is that, personally, I have never tried to get a pipe stub out of a fitting of this size - just the small stuff. Is it possible?

So there you have it. All comments or alternative approaches will be most welcome!

Cheers

Craig


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2015 8:11 pm 
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Craig,

The only proper way in my opinion would be to cut the "Tee" out, and make up a new "Tee" with "shorts" of pipe in the "Tee", with unions on the end of the "shorts" solvent welded out of place (dont forget to clean and lightly roughen up both the pipe and sockets, with emery cloth) and then left to set for 24 hours, then in the evening when you have finished with using water for at least 12 to 18 hours (24 hours is better), offer up the new section of pipework, mark on the existing pipework where the flat faces of the unions are, then cut out the old bit of pipework, check for snug fit of the new pipework to the existing pipework, with the other face of the unions loosely fitted to the existing pipework

Once you are happy with the "fit" clean and dry the pipes, lightly rough up the pipes with emery cloth, slip the nut of the union over the pipe, (the right way round) apply solvent cement to both the pipe and the socket part of the union, fit together and leave the fittings to set for at least 12 hours, 24 hours is best if you can afford to be without water for a day

Then once all this is done, slip the new pipework and "Tee" into place, slide the rubber washer between the two faces of the first union, and lightly screw it together, repeat for the other two unions, and when you are happy that the branch pipe is not being strained, by being slightly out of place, do up all the union nuts tight, but not over tight

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2015 11:58 am 
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Thanks very much Peake.

Yeah, I had a horrible feeling you were going to say that :( :o x_x . I know, I know - another case of, "Do it properly, or don't do it at all" ...

But you can't blame me for trying, can you? 8-| [-( . (Well yes, you can ...)

Thanks again.

Craig, not normally a bodger - honest!


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2015 9:23 pm 
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Craig,

Dont worry it can happen to the best of us, on rereading your first posting, I am worried about the pressure fluctuations in the pipework, PVC pipe does not like pressure fluctuations, could you not fit a pressure reducer so as to keep the water pressure stable

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2015 11:26 pm 
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Any space to be able to move the leaking 75mm pipe to the right for repairing?

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 11:48 am 
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peake wrote:
I am worried about the pressure fluctuations in the pipework, PVC pipe does not like pressure fluctuations, could you not fit a pressure reducer so as to keep the water pressure stable

Now THAT is an interesting observation, Peake.

'cos that pipe 'shocks' every time the pumps come on - which can be as often as every 10 seconds when demand is high. (The first time I saw it, I admit I did a double take - "Did that pipe really just jolt like that?!? Err, yep ...").

The whole installation dates from 2006 and is not good, being generally underspec'd and undersized - typical speculative developer and an incompetent/uncaring - if Pritzker Prize award-winnning :o - architect. Dunno if a services engineer was even involved ....

The pumps are prone to cycling despite the installation of a second pressure tank, and the water pressure on the upper floors (5 & 6) is appalling. Even with us, on the first floor, the flow is so low that you don't dare take a shower and flush the loo at the same time, despite adjusting the flat's individual pressure restictor. "Prestations haut de gamme? Mon cul ..."

So, unfortunately, I suspect installing a pressure restrictor/reducer on the main line isn't gonna be possible. 'Live with', it seems - ? Or maybe the controls of the pump set aren't doing what they should/could to maintain constant pressure? I don't know enuf about the operation of these systems, I'm afraid ...

Thanks again for your postings.

Craig


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 11:54 am 
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Teapot wrote:
Any space to be able to move the leaking 75mm pipe to the right for repairing?

Possibly, Théière. The pipe runs for, I dunno, 3-4m before it gets to the next solid fitting (a T going up thru the slab). So maybe by relaxing all the ceiling clamps it might be possible to move it a tad ...

(Haven't tried - bloomin' thing's full of water .. :lol: )


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 2:43 pm 
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Ventodue wrote:
Now THAT is an interesting observation, Peake.

'cos that pipe 'shocks' every time the pumps come on - which can be as often as every 10 seconds when demand is high. (The first time I saw it, I admit I did a double take - "Did that pipe really just jolt like that?!? Err, yep ...").

The whole installation dates from 2006 and is not good, being generally underspec'd and undersized - typical speculative developer and an incompetent/uncaring - if Pritzker Prize award-winnning :o - architect. Dunno if a services engineer was even involved ....

The pumps are prone to cycling despite the installation of a second pressure tank, and the water pressure on the upper floors (5 & 6) is appalling. Even with us, on the first floor, the flow is so low that you don't dare take a shower and flush the loo at the same time, despite adjusting the flat's individual pressure restictor. "Prestations haut de gamme? Mon cul ..."

So, unfortunately, I suspect installing a pressure restrictor/reducer on the main line isn't gonna be possible. 'Live with', it seems - ? Or maybe the controls of the pump set aren't doing what they should/could to maintain constant pressure? I don't know enuf about the operation of these systems, I'm afraid ...

Thanks again for your postings.

Craig


Craig,

Now I know a bit more about the installation, my first thoughts are, use the decennial assurance of the builder/plumber to get things put right

The 75 mm pipe is not in line with the 90 mm pipe, its "cocked" on the branch, so the joint between pipe and fitting is not equal all the way around the pipe and fitting

What capacity is the second pressure tank ?
I would have fitted one like this http://www.pompes-direct.com/modele/dg-8-bar/2770.html with a minimum capacity of 1000 litres, half water half air, the problem with these is that over time they get "waterlogged", IE: the air is used up by being dissolved in the water, and you have to drain out some of the water to replenish the air in the vessel, or one of these, http://www.pompes-direct.com/modele/dg-8-bar/2770.html of at least 500 litres capacity
Not allowing for any "head loss" through the pipework, you need at least 4 bar static at the pressure vessel, to give you 2 bar pressure at the top floor, but if the pipework is under sized, in the words of the Bard, you are well and truly buggered, no power on earth will give you the required volume of water at the required pressure

EDIT: I forgot to say, that I would use pipeclips at one metre distance, and also these people would be by far the cheapest to get pvc pipe fittings from, https://www.pipestock.com/pvc/pvc-pipe-fittings/plain-metric

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 4:04 pm 
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peake wrote:
<snip> ... use the decennial assurance of the builder/plumber to get things put right. The 75 mm pipe is not in line with the 90 mm pipe <snip>

See it, now you point it out. (Wow! Good observation - I'm impressed!). Can't say I'm surprised. According to a number of people who bought new here, the plumber on this contract was a fair incompetent - e.g. bath wastes not connected, towel rails plumbed up the wrong way round, leaks everywhere.

I'll talk to the syndic about a possibilty of a domages ouvrages claim. Altho' whether anyone wants that particular cowboy back on site is unsure ...

peake wrote:
What capacity is the second pressure tank ?

The original tank - the blue one here - is a piddling 200 litres! To that has now been added a larger (red) one. I can't see it's capacity label; but between them, I doubt we're up to 1000 litres.

Image

Image

peake wrote:
... the problem with these is that over time they get "waterlogged"

Understood. Can you give an idea of roughly how long this might take - 2 years, 3 years? I ask 'cos the second tank was installed 2 years ago, and I'm sure the pumps have recently started cycling more. And I don't suppose this can be good either, can it :-s ?

Image

peake wrote:
Not allowing for any "head loss" through the pipework, you need at least 4 bar static at the pressure vessel <snip>

The pumps are taking the pressure up to 6 bar, and then cut back in when it falls to 4.5. But boy, are they cycling! Less than every 10 seconds when I went to take the photos just now. That can't be right, can it? :-\


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 5:37 pm 
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Craig,

Both of the reservoirs are of the bladder type, and need to be checked at least every year, see if the pressure is still up to the pre-charged pressure, but I would not bother with the red one, 'cos its what you would called kcufed (back-slang), buggered, shot, and is full of water

The reason why the pumps are cycling like they are is because the reservoirs are, at least one reservoir is full of water, I cannot tell if the other one is as well, but its under sized to boot

The pumps should be controlled by control board, with one pump being the master pump, a second pump to cut in when it needs to, with the third pump as a stand by pump, in case a pump has to be removed/fails, with the sequence of the pumps working should be on a weekly basis

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 6:53 pm 
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peake wrote:
Both of the reservoirs are of the bladder type, and need to be checked at least every year

... which I'm pretty sure they're not. Or let's put it this way: the last intervention recorded in the log book that's left in the locale is June 2014. And no mention of a contrôle ...

peake wrote:
I would not bother with the red one, 'cos its what you would called kcufed (back-slang), buggered, shot, and is full of water

That's what I suspected :( .

peake wrote:
The reason why the pumps are cycling like they are is because the reservoirs are <snip>

Thanks. That's how I thought it/they worked (or didn't ...). Good to have confirmation.

peake wrote:
The pumps should be controlled by control board, with one pump being the master pump <snip>

Interesting. Makes sense. But that's not how they're set up/working now. They're simply all running in sequence, and each for less than 5 seconds each time. I can't see how they'll put up with that for very long ...

Once again, thanks very much for all your help. Trying to get informed replies round here seems virtually impossible - and I'm far from being the only who's been trying ~x( . Wouldn't like a trip to Montpellier would you, by any chance? :)


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 7:03 pm 
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Maybe you should ask on the link at the bottom of Peake's post.

You never know.


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 11:29 pm 
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Craig,

I would not mind a visit, but who would pay the cost ? bearing in mind that I am now in retirement and only have a French pension to live on, which ever way I went the costs would be around 500€

If I went by road, I reckon that it would take about 14 hours to get to Montpelier, going by rail would take about 8 hours, and if I flew from Rennes, my nearest airport, it would take about 6 hours, now wait for it, and dont laugh, I would be doing about 3 laps of France to get to Montpelier, the way Air France have set the flights up
From Rennes I would have a choice of going to Lyon (3 hrs 40 mins lay over) then to Paris Orly (1 hr 20 mins lay over)then to Montpelier, or Rennes to Marseille, Marseille to Nantes, Nantes to Montpelier, or Rennes to Toulouse, Toulouse to Nantes, Nantes to Montpelier, suppose that I could drive to Nantes, about a two and a half hour drive , I suppose the real question is would your Syndicate stand for the costs of me coming down to give them advice

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 9:23 am 
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The original point of pipe repair I could do in a jiffy but as Peake says, it's the travel. It sounds if the system needs a good overhaul as it's not working/setup properly

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 9:31 am 
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LOL! Love your routing possibilities! And to think I can be touching down in Gatwick 1¼ hours after taking off from here. Barking ...

You're a gent, Peake - and I will keep your offer in mind. But I really think we need to find a local solution. Problem is, Montpellier is (still!) boom town. It's like London in the late 80's, if you ever experienced that. The good guys are sur les grands chantiers, working all the hours that God made. Making money, I'm sure; but also heading for early heart attacks, nervous break-downs - and/or divorce. Which leaves plenty or room for the bodgers and 'Just off the Boats' for the little jobs and the hated maintenance contracts.

That said, our (ha, ha) maintenance contract - value: just under 900€/year - is with Proxiserve, a filiale of Véolia, and (I quote from their website, "Spécialiste de la maintenance et de la gestion des installations techniques dans les logements ...".

Ah oui, c'est ça ...

Once again - thanks.

Craig
P.s Have just e-mailed the Président of our conseil syndical with the good news. Am now awaiting the inevitable phone call ... ~o)


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 9:46 am 
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Thanks Théière - the thought is appreciated. Btw, a simple déplacement here in Montpellier is billed out at anything topside of 50€.

For the rest, I fear you're right: 'cos the more you look, the more you find.

I've tried to keep away from all this, but at a certain moment ... Me, I'm no plumber, just a poor ex-chippie turned project manager - and that was another life-time away. So while I might remember some of the basic theory learnt in college a long, long ago :shock: , for the detail and the reality, I'm floundering ...

And so is pretty much everyone else here, it would seem :D :YMPRAY:

(I think the last job I worked on with a boosted water sytem was c. 1989, in Croydon!)


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 11:40 pm 
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Sounds like the balloon in the red pressure vessel has burst and needs replacing to me.
The initial pipework has not been installed at the correct 90degs angles and therefore the glue has not spread correctly. It also looks like the Tee used was not as the same age and condition of the internal pipework/reducers.I would also presume that the cleaning of said fittings and sanding before glueing was not undertaken either.
The whole installation looks "cowboyish" and "shoddy" to me.

Re replacing the leaking tee, then I suggest unions as suggested before. If installed correctly then they should be as strong/good as any other coupling.
You could also reduce the larger pipework before the tee and thus slowly reduce the shock from 90-50 but the main problem is the angle that the 75mm was initially glued in at.
The pressure switch is constantly switching because the bag inside has burst and the pressure is not being regulated.
Call in a local irrigation firm as this is standard repair work or was when I did it in the UK 15 years ago.
Perhaps the water-hammer caused by the constant on/off of the pumps caused by the faulty pressure switch/vessel has also helped the misaligned tee fittings to unduly stressed.

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:44 am 
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Thanks Trigga - most appreciated. Good to have confirmation that we're all singing from the same hymn sheet.

The Véolia/Proxiserv guy is due to arrive in the next hour for the pressure vessels/pump cycling. This time, I'm going to make sure I'm present. More later ...


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 12:31 pm 
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Trigga wrote:
You could also reduce the larger pipework before the tee and thus slowly reduce the shock from 90-50


And what happens if you do this ?

1) You will starve the flats of water

2) You will need to increase the pressure to compensate the loss of water volume

3) Smaller diameter pipe = larger frictional head loss = more powerful pumps needed

Most times the water hammer effect is caused by a rapid closure of a valve, the flowing water rebounds off the closed valve back down the pipe, and thinking about this, this could be the cause of the rupture of the bladder in the pressure tank/s

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:02 pm 
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Ventodue wrote:
The Véolia/Proxiserv guy is due to arrive in the next hour <snip>. More later ...

And here’s le bilan after the visit:

1. The non-return valve (le clapet anti-retour as I now know it's called) on pump 2 wasn’t working, thereby allowing water to flow back thru the pump into the storage tank. So that’s been shut off, awaiting replacement.

2. The red booster tank is, as predicted by Peake, stuffed. It’s basically full of water, with no air left inside. It's going to be drained, the valve at the top replaced, and given another chance. But hope is not high. (3 years old, that's all ...).

P.s The plumber reckons both the tanks are the bladder type, not the diaphragm type. Does this seem right? Is there any way to tell? And does it even matter? :-)

3. The blue tank is also in dubious condition. It wouldn’t take a full air re-charge, so the diagnosis is that diaphragm/bag is either leaking or gone porous (do they do that?). It’s been drained, re-charged and is sous surveillance.

Hey ho ... But at least the pressure is now holding at 6 bar and the pumps aren't cycling. However, as you might expect, I am now looking it to just what our 'maintenance contract' of c.900€/year is meant to cover.


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:06 pm 
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Ventodue wrote:
2. The red booster tank <snip> ...the valve at the top replaced

Stupid question again - hope you don't mind. Is it, in fact, a valve? And what's it for anyways?

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:12 pm 
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Ventodue wrote:
Ventodue wrote:
The Véolia/Proxiserv guy is due to arrive in the next hour <snip>. More later ...

And here’s le bilan after the visit:

1. The non-return valve (le clapet anti-retour as I now know it's called) on pump 2 wasn’t working, thereby allowing water to flow back thru the pump into the storage tank. So that’s been shut off, awaiting replacement.

2. The red booster tank is, as predicted by Peake, stuffed. It’s basically full of water, with no air left inside. It's going to be drained, the valve at the top replaced, and given another chance. But hope is not high. (3 years old, that's all ...).

P.s The plumber reckons both the tanks are the bladder type, not the diaphragm type. Does this seem right? Is there any way to tell? And does it even matter? :-)

3. The blue tank is also in dubious condition. It wouldn’t take a full air re-charge, so the diagnosis is that diaphragm/bag is either leaking or gone porous (do they do that?). It’s been drained, re-charged and is sous surveillance.

Hey ho ... But at least the pressure is now holding at 6 bar and the pumps aren't cycling. However, as you might expect, I am now looking it to just what our 'maintenance contract' of c.900€/year is meant to cover.


Craig,

I would say replace both if they are in that kind of condition, they wont last long

Basic description of how they work, a "Bladder" tank has a rubber bladder inserted into the tank from the bottom, this holds the water, the tank is pressurised from the top, with a factory charge of nitrogen, via a Schroeder type valve (same as a car tyre valve), water enters the "bladder" and compresses the gas inside the tank

A diaphragm type of tank is basically the same except that the tank is in two halves, with a rubber diaphragm between the two halves, same principle water in the bottom, air/gas in the top

When the rubber bladder/diaphragm splits, gets leaky, the gas is absorbed by the water, the tank fills up with water, and you now know what happens

There is another type of tank without a bladder/diaphragm, this is larger and holds air in the top half, it works on the same principle as the other types, the air is compressed by the water, but because the air is slowly absorbed by the water, and without simple maintenance, the tank gets what is known as "waterlogged", to avoid this the tank has a sight gauge made from glass or clear plastic, and when the water in the sight gauge gets too high, the pumps are stopped, the air inlet at the top of the tank is opened, and some of the water in the tank run to waste, via a drain cock, when sufficient water has been run to waste the drain cock is closed, the air inlet at the top of the tank closed, and the pumps restarted

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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:24 pm 
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Ta Peake. Yup, understand the operating principle.

So, ex-factory, it's nitrogen rather than air? Any particular reason why, do you know? Just 'cos it's more inert - so why not? Our man this morning pumped the blue tank up with an air compressor ...

And any clue what the big valve on the top is for ?

Craig.


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 4:42 pm 
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Ventodue wrote:
Ta Peake. Yup, understand the operating principle.

So, ex-factory, it's nitrogen rather than air? Any particular reason why, do you know? Just 'cos it's more inert - so why not? Our man this morning pumped the blue tank up with an air compressor ... Sure as hell beats using a bicycle pump or a foot pump, both are hard work

And any clue what the big valve on the top is for ? Thats to get the bladder inside the tank

Craig.


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:00 am 
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Another little update:

1. The pumps are no longer short-cycling and seem to be working correctly, i.e. responding only to demand - I've noticed that the break tank starts re-charging after every 2 pump cycles.

2. The leak has STOPPED! No puddle on the floor, the joint is staying nice and dry. So seems Trigga was right to suggest that the pump cycling might be a contributory factor ... :ymapplause:

Craig


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 3:27 pm 
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peake wrote:
Ventodue wrote:
And any clue what the big valve on the top is for ? Thats to get the bladder inside the tank

Apparently Peake, with this type of tank i.e. one with a bladder inside, it's (also?) for mounting a pressure switch, should one be needed.

Image

"La vessie est moulée dans une seule pièce et fixée à l'intérieur des réservoirs (de 100 à 1000 litres) par une pièce de maintien supérieure dont l'orifice peut servir au montage d'une soupape ou d'un contacteur manométrique".


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 Post subject: Re: Advice, please, on how best to repair a leaky pipe fitti
PostPosted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:16 pm 
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Thats the kiddy Craig,

I would use a pressure switch on the tank to control the pumps, [ pump one the master pump (for the week/month), pump two to cut in when needed, pump three the stand by pump ] all to be controlled by the control panel, this way you have one pump running, with another pump ready to cut in if needed, and another pump on stand by, in case of a pump failure

I would set the sequencing of the pumps to change every week, so all pumps get a fair crack of the whip, and no pump is sitting idle for a month

Depending on the number of occupants of the property, I would tend to go for a minimum capacity of at least 500 litres, maybe a 1000 litres or more if the numbers are high (allow a hundred litres (about 23 gallons) of water a day per occupant, for all usage) divided by four, so that the pumps are not running all the time, through an undersized tank, and that there is not an excess of water in the tank to stagnate, through sitting in the tank for too long a time, because of an oversized tank

As you can see its a fine balance between over sizeing and under sizeing the tank capacity

I would also fit a pressure relief valve, on the top of the tank, set to "lift" at about one bar over the pump cut off switch pressure setting, in case of a pressure switch failure in the on position, I look at it this way, I would prefer to see water "pissing" out of a safety valve than having to repair the pipe line, because it had ruptured through over pressure

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